The Effeminacy of Religion
WARNING: This is an explicit discussion of sexual issues in religion, from the passivity it requires of men and women and how it neglects sexual brokenness and temptation. This results in so many people living lost in their struggles instead of being transformed by his life. Sometimes hilarious and sometimes intense, Wayne and Brad take the lid off of the sexual dysfunction of religion and provide hope that God can redeem us out of our brokenness and failures and bring us into the fullness of his life.
I’m sorry guys, but I couldn’t travel down the road with you on this one as much as some of the great podcasts and that’s okay – I enjoy the tension of rethinking some of my basic presuppositions. I suppose since I’ve moved out of the institutionalised church (now nearly 12 months) I’m finding life with Christ and NOT with the connections that I made in that other life. To that end I figure that I just don’t have to spend much time thinking about that other system. You guys most probably still have something to say to those folks, I just don’t see what the point is continuing to row that boat and keep going back to a system that I’ve left. It’s gone – I’m living somewhere else now. I still meet with christians still committed to the system. I’m saying less and loving more. If folks cannot see the life of Christ in me then what’s the point of trying to convince folks intellectually that I am right and they are not. Seems like I’d be playing the same sick game with the same broken rules.
One thing I could say is that stereotypes can be really destructive. When you peel away the layers there is a real live person in there. I’m just uncomfortable when we talk about matters of sexuality or religious expression in a way that ultimately belittles people. Messy, broken, lost, hurting and prideful people – people just like me. On the other hand the circumcision song story was pretty damn funny.
One final comment, there is a tremendous amount of dysfunctionality about sex right across the board – both christian and non-christian; male, female and transgender 🙂 Same goes with all of our appetites – we are just a bunch of hopeless cases accepted by a loving God. It’s not just in the church – it’s everywhere and it’s pervasive. But it doesn’t stop me from loving those people, no matter where they are at – whatever they are struggling or even revelling in.
Anyway I’m off to paint my nails and darn I’ve just laddered those expensive fish-net stockings I bought on eBay recently.
Your conflicted fellow traveller,
Guys – love the podcast. But wondering about this one. I don’t feel like you ever really articulated your points….”what is the effiminacy of religion”? – never really was answered directly. A lot of “don’t you hate it when….” or “what’s with this….” but felt like a broken record.
A few times Wayne suggested not posting that podcast – go with your gut on those wayne! If it’s not a constructive or meaningful conversation….don’t suppose others will want to listen in!
That said – could be an interesting topic to explore more…but try and articulate your thougths a bit more or something.
I do want to thank you both for what a blessing your podcast is – even the ones I don’t love as much as the others. It’s fantastic how the Lord is using you to speak truth – especially in a loving way. I think that’s one of the things that truly sets you apart from others on a similar journey. you’re not angry or reacting….your responding with the Father’s heart and as a result, I believe, setting people free. (or showing them the way to freedom!)
bless you both – and i’ll keep listening despite this one that “missed the mark”!
You guys have such an incredibly narrow view of the church. It seems that you have some bitterness toward a church that needs to be dealt with. Sexual brokenness is an extremely important topic, but your flippant treatment of the subject is quite frankly DISTURBING! Laughing about the fact that 60% of pastors struggle with pornography is downright bizzare/scary.
Your disconnection from the Body of Christ is leading you down a distorted path. You might consider praying about reconnecting with a church for the sake of your families. Although you may not realize it, there are many many different types of churches with which to connect.
P.S. The very best examples of manhood can be seen serving faithfully in churches all over this planet.
I guess I was usure about the topic on this podcast too… you kinda changed subjects midway and went into sexual issues within the church rather than really defining what “effeminicy of religion” was. I in fact wondered if it would not be offencive to women to talk about it that way too.
there is nothing wrong with effeminacy (as long as it is a female) so if it makes people effeminate… that is ok for women right?
I guess I did not understand where you started out to go on this one.
I agree that in some circles religion can dull some aspects of what it means to be a true christian man… but with all the joking and then the subject shift… I never really heard what you were getting at.
* confused *
Wow! Words fail me. DisGRACEful!!! Listened to the first few minutes and had to stop. It’s a good thing our Lord did not and does not manifest the attitude(s) you “men” do. I am grateful for a God who sees beyond externals to the heart and was the most masculine of all men to walk the Earth. It is quite apparent that you do not have any true understanding of sexual brokenness, otherwise you would not have been so flippant and casual in your words. May God be gracious and merciful to you both.
Sad and confused.